Sensible Centrist Podcast – Episode 8: Ringleader

SCP#8

Today, I interview ringleader, a writer from the Southern United States, whom I met interacting in Walt Bismarck’s space. Ringleader strongly identifies with his Southern heritage, and subscribes to the Jeffersonian and Dixiecrat Populist traditions.

We discuss constitutionalism, the history of the Southern United States, Ringleader’s ‘Backyard Nationalism’ our opinions on Donald Trump so far, and a brief segment at the end on British politics.

Timestamps

• Introduction – 00:00 – 03:36
• We make fun of mainstream libertarians – 03:37 – 04:11
• We agree on the ‘good’ parts of libertarianism; Ron Paul and following the 10th Amendment, strict constructionism/Originalism. We both agree that on the state-level, libertarianism is a terrible ideology – 04:12 – 05:53
• I discuss if the 10th Amendment was doomed, following my article on the subject, I talk about constitutional designs which I think would’ve worked better, and mention my podcast the previous day with Philosopher of the Oil Sands – 05:53 – 09:17
• Ringleader wonders if the Civil War was inevitable. We debate the causes of the civil war, and whilst seeing the debate about the expansion of slavery differently, both agree that the Confederate states should have been able to peacefully leave the union – 09:18 – 12:38
• Not just liberals, but Claremonter ‘Orthodox Neoconservatives’ who currently form the intellectual heft of MAGA, parrot out this propaganda narrative about the Declaration, Abraham Lincoln, and the union – 12:39 – 13:21
• Ringleader wonders whether Trump will devolve power back to the states, and return the federal government closer to its constitutionally-authorised role. I bring up Richard Nixon’s ‘New Federalism’ idea, and whether he was taken out by the deep state. We both agree Richard Nixon was one of the better presidents, though Executive Order 11478 was terrible – 13:22 – 15:36
• No… Ringleader does not support lynching… Ringleader puts the historical Southern United States in perspective. It was very easy for the Yankees to look down on the South, because they didn’t actually live and work alongside Blacks in most cases. We both agree that there is always an elite in society. Slavery in the Antebellum South wasn’t an exceptional evil, but more like medieval serfdom – 15:37 – 25:24
• How might slavery have ended if the Confederacy had become independent? Would it have been made obsolete? Ringleader gives some more examples where the ‘Woke are more correct than the Intellectual Dark Web’ – 25:25 – 28:05
• The Civil War was a tragedy that harmed both Blacks and Whites. Northern oppression of the South created a vicious backlash which meant Blacks were disenfranchised for longer than they would have been if the South had been allowed to secede and slavery had been allowed to end peacefully. We both agree universal suffrage does not make sense, and I ask if the Southern United States could have naturally evolved into a society like Rhodesia – 28:06 – 32:03
• Why it is not a bad thing to ‘look out for your own’, and doing so does not mean one automatically hates other groups. We agree that, despite excesses, Klu Klux Klan was good at defending heterosexual White interests from the humiliation of Reconstruction. The moment they let their guard down, the Woke conquered them. Heterosexual White men and their female relatives are endlessly trampled and spat on today by the Woke, and it would be a great thing if they started properly fighting back like Southern Whites did – 32:04 – 33:47
• Ringleader points out that Black self-improvement and autonomous civil society institutions and businesses, like what existed from people like Booker T. Washington and Marcus Garvey, would have led to much more prosperity for African-American communities than the Civil Rights Regime, which destroyed these Black institutions. I discuss the ‘Little Federal Model’ which existed in many states prior to Reynolds vs Sims, and whether Blacks could have carved out their own enclaves as a means of dealing with a majority Black population (Robert Stark) – 33:48 – 37:30
• Black people, by crying ‘racist’ in order to get special treatments, are not morally evil for looking out for their own, White people should just look out for their own more. We ask if Trump taking a sledgehammer to DEI might incentivise Blacks to start their own autonomous institutions and businesses again – 37:31 – 39:10
• What are the differences between Paleoconservatism and the Southern Populist tradition? We both agree that Paleoconservatism is a middle-way between Paleolibertarianism and Southern Populism represented by people like George Wallace – 39:11 – 41:42
• Ringleader discusses his ‘Backyard Nationalism’ idea. I compare it to Orania in South Africa and Rod Dreher’s ‘The Benedict Option’. We talk about how state power, whilst it’s important that it isn’t overtly repressive towards you, is limited in what it can achieve. Organic communities must emerge organically, outside of the state. Ringleader is thinking super long-term, aka, what will America look like 250 years from now? – 41:43 – 47:12
• How does Ringleader think Donald Trump is doing so far? – 47:13 – 48:20
• We joke about how, surprisingly, ‘Drag Queen Story Hour’ was not what the Founding Fathers had in mind. Ringleader goes on a digression about an intersex person in Antebellum America – 48:21 – 51:32
• We get back to the script, and talk about Donald Trump and the passage of his agenda – 51:33 – 59:55
• What are Ringleader’s thoughts on a constitutional convention? I express my surprise at Daniella Pentsak’s ‘John Birch Society’ involvement, and my respect for Kevin Roberts (guy behind Project 2025) – 59:56 – 1:06:59
• The Supreme Court and the Federalist Society – 1:07:00 – 01:07:49
• Is Ringleader familiar with RedStateSecession.org? What are his thoughts about secession generally, even if a Blue State wanted to do it? I mention Robert Stark’s sympathies for Calexit – 1:07:50 – 1:10:12
• Why the ‘Corwin Amendment’ proves the Civil War wasn’t about slavery – 1:10:13 – 1:11:45
• Why Ringleader thinks Blue States seceding is a good thing – 1:11:46 – 1:12:38
• How does Ringleader interpret his Anglo-Celtic, American, and Southern identity? I talk about how I wish a compromise could have been found which would have prevented the American Revolutionary War and kept the Anglosphere united – 1:12:39 – 1:19:49
• I ask about Ringleader’s position on Southern Populist leaders like William Jennings Bryan. I talk about Jeff Taylor’s excellent book ‘A Politics on a Human Scale’ which is about the Jeffersonian Populist tradition in America, and about how the US might look had the decentralist side of the Progressive Era won out – 1:19:50 – 1:24:46
• I briefly touch upon British politics and the Farage/Lowe situation – 1:24:46 – 01:30:39
• Closing – 01:30:39 – 01:31:24